Episode Transcript
WEBVTT
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Hey guys, this is Rachel and
recover. We're back and with the nutritionist
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on trauma, Carolyne Thompson, and
she's going to tell the rest of her
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story. Thanks for listening. All
Right, have you noticed any patterns and
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how Trauma Effects Processing Food and patients
with trauma? Yeah, what do you
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are that pastics processing to it?
Yeah, like, I guess literally just
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some food are like the effects of
yeah, so I think anytime we have
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a history of trauma that is stored
in our body. It's stored in our
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nervous system. There's a ton of
new research coming out on this. There's
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a really great book called the body
keeps the score, which is literally the
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story of how trauma is stored in
the body and this can manifest in different
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conditions. It can manifest in stress
related condition. So one of those being
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stress, anxiety and problems with actually
digesting food. And there's a lot of
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reasons for this. Number one is
that stress and anxiety there's actually a nerve,
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the vaguest nerve, that travels from
the brain to the stomach. This
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is the nerve that creates like butterflies
when you're nervous or upset, and so
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we know, we have this nervous
system that connects our brains to our digestion
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and when we're stressed, when we're
anxious, when we are, you know,
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on high alert, and typically if
we have a history of trauma,
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are nervous systems are on high alert
because we are maybe hyper vigilant or,
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you know, particularly overwhelmed from that
history, and that can prevent our body
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from digesting food as well as it
should. So if we've got this nervous
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stimulation to the digestive tract, it
doesn't actually digest our food as well as
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it could because it is constantly stimulated
throughout the day rather than being naturally stimulated
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when food enters the stomach goes through
the process of digestion and gets to turn
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off. Digestion is some thing that
really does need periods of being on and
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working and turning off and not digesting. And so if we're always kind of
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stimulating our nervous system and that then
stimulates our digestive system, that can cause
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some issues that may manifest with people
in terms of like stomach pain, a
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condition called IBS, or irritable Bowel
Syndrome, where we have trouble, you
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know, just having regular bowel movements
because our stomach is in our intestines are
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constantly stimulated. I know you know
again, lots of ways that I can
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manifest. I mean I definitely saw
post related that you posted about IBS and
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the fod map diet and, you
know, getting rid of gluten and sugar
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at everything. What's your thoughts on
that? Like, I know you had
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mentioned that before. Yeah, so
I have IBS personally, so it's definitely
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a topic that's near and dear to
my heart and a lot of people actually
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have, a lot of people,
I should say, with a history of
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disordered eating, actually do have IBS, and one of the reasons that is
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causing that or behind that is that
when you go through years or period of
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time where you're under eating and then
suddenly you eat or you start eating more
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regularly, that unpredictability can cause a
lot of bloating, a lot of gi
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issues, stomach pain, and so
a lot of people with the history of
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disordered eating or eating disorders have some
type of Gi issue because of the level
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of restriction, and there's also a
lot of internal physiology that happens. When
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we restrict foods. We actually do
decrease our enzymes quite a bit. So
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we don't digest certain foods as well. So if you cut out gluten,
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if you cut out dairy, the
first time you try to eat gluten or
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dairy again, it may not go
well because your body has adapted to not
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eating those foods. And so there
is definitely a correlation to restricting your food
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and then how your body responds when
you introduce it again. And sometimes that
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takes some time and you know,
trial and error to get your body kind
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of back on track. But you
know, when you talk about the fodd
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map diet, which, for people
who may maybe aren't familiar, the fod
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map diet is fod maps are different
types of fibers in our foods, mostly
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in plants, so in fruits,
vegetables, whole grains, nuts and seeds,
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and a lot of these foods are
healthy, right. So they these
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fibers can cause some GI issues,
even from healthy foods. And what tends
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to happen is you get a diagnosis
of IBS and your doctor recommends a low
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fod map diet, but we don't
always look behind the curtain and try to
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figure out why we're having these di
Gi issues first before we then restrict more
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foods. So it's definitely complex.
There's a lot of nuance some people.
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I've had clients who do really well
with a low fod map diet. They're
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no type of restriction or disordered eating
issue. And then I have other clients
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that their IBS is directly related to
disordered eating, years and years of disordered
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eating, and you know, a
low fod map diet is probably not going
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to necessarily make that better. They
just need to kind of food well.
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And, as you mentioned, the
body keeps scoring with the I don't immune
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diseases on the rise, with trauma
victims, and how does that relate to
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how does that affect nutrition? Yeah, yeah, that's definitely interesting when we
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think about the body keeping the score
autoimmune where your body is, you know,
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literally attacking itself for one reason or
another. That is what an autoimmune
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disease is and you know, there's
so many different types of autoimmune diseases that
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it's hard to say exactly one nutrition
protocol or one plan that's going to work.
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But I think the bigger picture is
you know, are you nourishing yourself?
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Are you eating regular meals? If
you're dealing with something that's you know,
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really draining, very tiring. Dealing
with autoimmune issues can be incredibly draining.
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I mean it is sometimes hard to
even get a diagnosis, depending on
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what it is, so you can
be hard to identify it. So I
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think the biggest thing is just,
you know, how are you taking care
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of yourself through a diagnosis like that
and you know, what are you doing
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day today that will improve your health, mental health and physical health, and
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nutrition can be a huge part of
that. But more restriction may not always
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be the answer. You know,
there's a autoimmune protocol diet which some people
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find super helpful and I would never
discount that. I think there have been
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a lot of great reports of the
autoimmune protocol, AIP, but I think
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something you know, even beyond that. I've talked to a lot of people
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with autoimmune disease and they will relay
to me that the stress that they already
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fal and the like anxiety that they
maybe even feel on a day to day
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basis wouldn't really be helped by following
this super strict protocol indefinitely and making their
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life more stressful. And so I
think, you know, with autoimmune disease
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specifically, we do need to kind
of waigh those pros and cons of you
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know, what's worth it for you? Is it worth it to take on
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more stress and more restriction at a
time when your body's already under a lot
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of stress and not, you know, functioning optimally? Maybe more food could
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just be more food, more balanced
options, more regular nutrition, all of
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those things. Maybe that could be
enough for you until, if and when,
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you were ready to, you know, have something more structure in Kay.
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So that's what I thought there.
What do you feel it would be
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the most helpful for trauma patients when
it comes to nutrition? What do you
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feel? Yeah, so I think
the biggest thing is really learning to drop
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dieting, letting go of restriction,
learning to listen to your body. If
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that's not something that you've ever done, that can sound like Super Woo Woo
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right, to just trust your body, listen to your hunger cues. Right,
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that can sound like foreign to a
lot of people. I totally get
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that. But again, you know, I go back to if the choices
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are starting another diet and feeling like
a failure at the end of that diet
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and feeling like it didn't work for
you. You know, a lot of
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people get to a kind of a
rock bottom place with that and they just
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want to do something else. They're
so tired of dieting that they're ready to
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let go of restriction. So,
you know, if that's you listening to
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this, then I definitely would recommend
embracing that mindset and starting with just trying
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to listen to your hunger, your
fullness, without restriction. Tell us a
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little bit more about intuitive eating and
when working with trauma victims. Yeah,
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so intuitive eating is an approach that
is weight neutral, meaning it's not a
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weight loss diet plan, and it's
really just based on following your body's cues.
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So again, sounds very simple,
simple, but it can be really
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hard to implement if you have a
long history of dieting, because a lot
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of times people will tell me,
you know, I wouldn't even know the
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first place to start with listening to
my hunger cues. I I don't even
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know when I'm full. I have
never really thought about that. And so
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dieting also can change hunger and fullness. Years of dieting can actually change the
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way we experience hunger and some people
don't even feel hungry anymore if they've restricted
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for a long time. So it's
definitely an approach that works really well for
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people who want to stop dieting,
who want a better relationship with food and
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who want a better relationship with their
bay. Tell us a little bit more
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about mindful eating when dealing with trauma
victims. Sure. So, mindful eating
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is similar to intuitive eating, except
that it is not a weight neutral approach.
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So intuitive eating is is weight neutral, meaning, you know, it's
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not a weight loss diet plan.
Mindful eating can sometimes entail weight loss.
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So that's how they differ. Mindful
eating is simply just being present while we
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are eating, so trying to remove
distractions, trying to engage with our food
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in terms of how it looks,
how it feels, how it smells,
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how it tastes of course, all
of our senses right, engaging all of
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our senses in our food and trying
to slow down and be present during eating
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in hopes that we can kind of
connect to our hunger and fullness better and
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really learn how to connect with our
food and power food is affecting our bodies.
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So, in a nutshell, that
is mindful eating is, you know,
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really just using those experiences around food
to be more in tune with our
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bodies. But it's not necessarily about
being weight neutral or antiweight loss the way
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that into Iti be. What would
you recommend for those who are wanting to
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try intuitive eating, our mindful eating, like how to go about that?
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I mean, is it? You
know, tell us, tell us you
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know the you know, what are
some options out there, because, I
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mean, I think it's a good
avenue, but I feel like it's not.
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Yeah, you know, you know
what are some books or some programs
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out there? Facebook, look,
you know that sort of things. Resources
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out there that you have found helpful? Yes, so there actually is a
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book. Intuitive eating is the ultimate
intuitive eating book, written by two Dietitians
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who are incredible. That would be
a really great place to start, just
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to dip your toe in and,
you know, kind of familiarize yourself with
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the approach. I also really love
we talked a little bit about, you
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know, overeating or feeling like you're
kind of in this pattern of under eating
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and overeating. There's a great book
called overcoming overeating. So if that is
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something that you connect more with than
maybe into it a beating, that is
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also a great approach and can really
help you understand why we overeat and what
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to do about it. So that's
a great book you also might consider.
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You know, of course I'm biased
as a Dietitian. I think, you
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know, everybody could probably use a
Dietitian at some point. But I think
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finding a Dietitian that aligns with what
you're looking for is a really important so
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if you are interested in into it, of eating, going to an intuitive
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eating counselor or an into it,
a eating Dietitian is going to be key.
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If you go to just any Dietitian, they may not, you know,
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follow that approach and so that could
definitely throw you for a loop if
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that's something that you're looking for.
Same thing with mindful eating. There are
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a lot of Dietitians. I would
definitely be in the mindful eating category.
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I am not completely against people losing
weight, but I tend to steer people
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towards a better relationship with food and
being more mindful first and, you know,
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seeing where that takes us before we
explore, you know, anything in
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the realm of we us. So
certainly people with the history of, you
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know, serious disordered eating and eating
disorders knead into it of eating. People
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with, you know, no history
of those things probably would do well to
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focus on mindful eating and, you
know, possibly internating as well. Is
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there anything else you would like to
add or tell us about, mean working
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with mindful eating? One or some
good, good advice for mindful eating?
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Yeah, so I think when I
think of mindful eating, I think of
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being more present and less distracted.
I think of maybe keeping a journal,
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like a food journal. I actually
have many of my clients do that and
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they find it really helpful. And
that doesn't have to be, you know,
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Calorie counting, but a food journal
could be literally just like writing it
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down, taking pictures, keeping a
log and talking to a Dietitian about it,
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monitoring your hunger and fullness queues,
those are different things that we could
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do all tracking or journaling about when
it comes to mind the eating. So
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that is a really great step because
it's going to help you build awareness,
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it's going to help you understand how
food is affecting you and it oftentimes helps
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us pick up on patterns day over
day of how, you know, our
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days tend to go when it comes
to food. There's something about writing it
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down that just kind of does that
to our brains. So that's a really
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great starting place and that's what I
recommend with okay and everyone. For those
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of like with you know, struggling
with trauma and seeing counselor about eating an
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addition to their trauma. How how
do you guys coordinate? How do you
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guys work together on that? As
a nutritionist, yeah, most of my
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clients have a counselor or therapist and
I tend to coordinate with those folks a
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lot. So, you know,
there's a lot of crossover right between what
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we're talking about in therapy and what
we're talking about in nutrition sessions and we
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try to coordinate that as best as
we can between myself and the therapist and
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you know, we also we spend
a lot of time talking about how there
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are different emotions or feelings are affecting
the food choices that they're making. So,
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you know, things that we may
discover and therapy about ourselves, we
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can really use that in the nutrition
session to better understand why we make the
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choices we make. You know,
particularly around like stress eating and emotional eating,
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those being coping mechanisms and where we
kind of learned to cope in that
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way or if we want to learn
to cope in a new way. Those
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can all be really big parts and
were process like. I guess can you
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kind of tell us how that looks
like for you on your end, coordinating
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with a therapist, like with a
pain about a patient? Yeah, well,
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in terms of like the logistics of
how we coordinate, you know,
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every patient has to sign off that
we're allowed to talk to each other,
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so that therapists and I both have
permission to talk to each other, and
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it just depends on the scenario.
You know, sometimes we're talking once a
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month, sometimes we're emailing back and
forth, sometimes we are only talking when
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something major comes up and we really
need to intervene together and be on the
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same page. So, you know, it really just depends on the level
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of support that the client or the
patient needs. And, you know,
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between the therapist and I, how
we decip like how would somebody go about
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setting that up, like with with
a therapist and nutritious that work together?
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Are there like are there people that
regularly team up together, or is it
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just a patient by patient bass or, you know, is there like programs
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or how does that work, or
what have you seen work? Yeah,
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so there are programs, you know, for specific eating disorders. Like,
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for example, I'm involved in a
binge eating disorder program nearby in Northern Virginia
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and you know, we have therapists
and Dietitians there that are connected and so
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they're all on the same team.
They work under one roof. But for
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somebody like me, who, you
know, I have an independent private practice,
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when I come, when a patient
comes to me and says, you
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know, I'm I would like to
work with you, I need help with
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my relationship with food, one of
my first questions is if they have a
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therapist and if they don't have one
them, were probably going to find them
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one as soon as we can.
And then that process is just, you
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know, me reaching out to the
therapist or the therapist reaching out to me,
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and so I think on some level
the provider, the Dietitian, the
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therapist, has to have an interest
in doing that, you know, going
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that extra step and talking to other
providers there. It's probably true that not
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everybody is willing to do that,
but I think it's really important that everybody
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is on the same page and that
we do communicate on some level. So
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if you are the client or you
are the patient, I would have them
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actually in their interview process of interviewing
Dietitians and therapists a like. Are you
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willing to talk to my other providers
as needed? You know I need all
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of my health care members feel on
the same team, so I would even
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kind of put that as one of
your interviewers. Anything else you would like
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to add before we wrap up?
No, I think we covered a great
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spectrum here. If anybody wants to
connect with me, I'm happy to answer
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any any follow up questions. And
Yeah, I'm on Instagram at not your
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average Dietitian, and then my website
is caroline tysondcom. All right, guys,
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thanks for listening. Caroline, thanks
for coming on our show and,
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as always, will be back on
air on Thursday at ten am and you
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can always follow us on our your
favorite social media platform or your favorite podcast
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platform and, as always, come
to Rachel and Recoverycom. Thanks for listening.
