Episode Transcript
WEBVTT
1
00:00:00.200 --> 00:00:03.319
Hey, this is Rachel recovery.
We are back with Steve and he's going
2
00:00:03.359 --> 00:00:10.000
to tell us the rest of his
story about being a significant other of partners
3
00:00:10.080 --> 00:00:20.399
was who have been sectually abused.
We've talked to indsociation. How much regression
4
00:00:20.760 --> 00:00:24.879
have you seen or, like how
is that commonly talked about? Like their
5
00:00:24.960 --> 00:00:29.800
partners regressing to like the age that
they were abused and they come out and
6
00:00:29.960 --> 00:00:33.679
they act like Ei. There you
know, however, old when the abuse
7
00:00:33.759 --> 00:00:39.439
happened? Yeah, I haven't.
That's been raised a couple of times racial
8
00:00:39.520 --> 00:00:48.159
but not a lot. What is
more common is when a survivors kids get
9
00:00:48.240 --> 00:00:51.719
to be the same age they were
when the abuse happened. HMM, that
10
00:00:51.840 --> 00:00:59.759
seems to trigger the onset of flashbacks
and issues and because if that your kid,
11
00:00:59.960 --> 00:01:03.200
right that you love, is now
the same age you were when you
12
00:01:03.320 --> 00:01:08.079
were first abused and you know you
love your kid so much and you don't
13
00:01:08.120 --> 00:01:11.519
want to see anything bad happen to
them, and I think that that starts
14
00:01:11.640 --> 00:01:15.159
then to stir up a lot of
the same issues. Is that the survivor
15
00:01:15.280 --> 00:01:22.280
went through and that more common trigger, I think. But the regression,
16
00:01:22.480 --> 00:01:29.159
I haven't seen that reference to a
whole lot. Okay, I mean it's
17
00:01:29.239 --> 00:01:34.159
just something I've had people comment on
me about and I've also I've heard other
18
00:01:34.280 --> 00:01:48.319
people's talk about the regressing. So
so I was curious I see what are
19
00:01:48.439 --> 00:01:52.120
like. What are some like big
issues that you what are like? Maybe
20
00:01:52.280 --> 00:02:00.640
the top couple issues you see within
relationships with sexual abuse? Yeah, some
21
00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:06.719
of the top ones intimacy interruests,
which I've talked about. You know,
22
00:02:07.040 --> 00:02:10.719
it was there and then it went
away or it was never quite there but
23
00:02:12.000 --> 00:02:16.800
it was kind of ignored. So
intimacy and trust issues are big. Another
24
00:02:17.039 --> 00:02:28.280
big issue is infidelity. So you
know, maybe your partner of a survivor
25
00:02:28.360 --> 00:02:32.199
and that survivor, behind your back, without you knowing, is on dating
26
00:02:32.240 --> 00:02:38.000
sites looking the hook up with other
people. That is fairly common. The
27
00:02:38.159 --> 00:02:45.960
infidelity, whether it's actually carried through
or not, you know, and that's
28
00:02:46.039 --> 00:02:47.919
really confusing for a partner because like, well, you can go have sex
29
00:02:49.000 --> 00:02:53.199
with complete strangers practically, but you
can't have sex with me, who you
30
00:02:53.280 --> 00:02:55.719
know. I've been your husband for
the last ten years. So what gives?
31
00:02:55.879 --> 00:03:00.680
You know, people don't understand that. It's another one thing, though,
32
00:03:00.800 --> 00:03:07.319
is the the infidelity anger management issues
is big. You know, when
33
00:03:08.240 --> 00:03:13.120
when partners start recovery. A lot
of times there can be a lot of
34
00:03:13.159 --> 00:03:15.400
anger that gets stirred up and a
lot of anger that have to come out
35
00:03:15.960 --> 00:03:22.879
because the abuser put so much anger
into them as kids. That anger comes
36
00:03:22.919 --> 00:03:29.120
out and it can be very missy, particularly if you know you have kids
37
00:03:29.199 --> 00:03:32.199
yourself. Right, if you're a
family with a couple of kids and now
38
00:03:32.599 --> 00:03:39.360
mom or dad has all this anger
and socialized relation and you know just happened
39
00:03:39.400 --> 00:03:46.680
overnight, then that can be another
really big issue. Those are sort of
40
00:03:46.719 --> 00:03:55.199
the top ones that seem to recur
a lot. Okay, houses impacted,
41
00:03:55.520 --> 00:04:05.680
like parenting and like you know,
with both partners, like both the abuse
42
00:04:08.080 --> 00:04:13.599
survivors and the and their partners.
Well, you know, on a good
43
00:04:13.680 --> 00:04:18.839
day parenting is tough, you know
is having kids is not for the faint
44
00:04:18.879 --> 00:04:27.319
of heart. Having kids when there's
stress in the relationship is is even tougher.
45
00:04:29.279 --> 00:04:35.240
I think kids don't understand right part
of us because we try to hide
46
00:04:35.240 --> 00:04:39.759
it from them. Part of it
is because maybe they're not ready to hear
47
00:04:40.319 --> 00:04:46.959
about the the real causes of what's
going on. The kids see this and
48
00:04:46.120 --> 00:04:50.680
it impacts them. You might see
it impacted in their behavior. In school
49
00:04:53.360 --> 00:04:59.079
you might see them favoring one parent
or the other. You know, if
50
00:05:00.879 --> 00:05:08.120
if the survivor is the mom and
maybe she's off being promiscuous, then the
51
00:05:08.240 --> 00:05:11.879
kids look at that and say that's
just not right, and so they are
52
00:05:12.000 --> 00:05:16.079
sort of driven away from mom over
to dad. or I've seeing, you
53
00:05:16.160 --> 00:05:25.240
know, cases to where the survivor, because of whatever reasons, I'm not
54
00:05:25.319 --> 00:05:28.959
sure what reasons, but they might
convince the kids that, you know,
55
00:05:29.199 --> 00:05:32.680
everything that's happening. That's bad with
me is because your father, your father's
56
00:05:33.040 --> 00:05:38.560
at fault, for example, and
then the kids driven away from her,
57
00:05:38.759 --> 00:05:43.160
from the partner, over to the
survivor. The kids get caught up in
58
00:05:43.279 --> 00:05:46.560
this. You know, anytime this
relationship issue, the kids get caught up
59
00:05:46.639 --> 00:05:50.399
in it and it's not easy.
So, you know, the other thing
60
00:05:50.480 --> 00:05:58.240
that happens to is, you know, divorce. Divorce happens, and when
61
00:05:58.680 --> 00:06:03.759
the parents get divorced it can be
really tough on the kids. Yeah,
62
00:06:04.040 --> 00:06:13.560
no, I mean that's also very
true. How have you seen it impact,
63
00:06:13.879 --> 00:06:20.360
you know, the health of partners? And there's survivers, like from
64
00:06:20.439 --> 00:06:27.279
your perspective, you know, I
can't talk so much for the survivors but
65
00:06:28.160 --> 00:06:34.680
for partners. You know, I
do know that there are physical issues in
66
00:06:35.000 --> 00:06:41.519
anytime you're under a lot of stress, and we know this what it regardless
67
00:06:41.560 --> 00:06:46.040
of what stress is, any time
that there's the stress, it does impact
68
00:06:46.120 --> 00:06:53.959
your health. You can drive some
isolation because, you know, maybe you
69
00:06:54.040 --> 00:06:59.439
become more isolated from friends and family
because of behavioral problems or relationship problems,
70
00:06:59.600 --> 00:07:03.920
or maybe you just don't have the
energy. You know, I'm fairly introverted,
71
00:07:04.040 --> 00:07:08.680
so you know, if I don't
have any energy to go out and
72
00:07:09.319 --> 00:07:15.079
be social with people, you know
that's not a good thing. But you
73
00:07:15.160 --> 00:07:21.680
know, it can drive that sort
of isolation. When when people are able
74
00:07:21.800 --> 00:07:26.959
to work through the issues or they
move on, either through, you know,
75
00:07:27.079 --> 00:07:32.879
dissolving the relationship or divorce. I
know in my case my health improved,
76
00:07:33.680 --> 00:07:40.319
my outlook on life of improved a
lot and I've seen that, you
77
00:07:40.399 --> 00:07:45.240
know, for other partners to and
it's just whatever you would think, you
78
00:07:45.319 --> 00:07:48.720
know, would be the result of
normal stress on a person. I think
79
00:07:48.759 --> 00:08:01.279
it's the same thing. Yeah,
how has have you seen this impact finances
80
00:08:01.480 --> 00:08:09.879
as partners? It's yeah, I
can have quite an impact, you know,
81
00:08:09.000 --> 00:08:16.279
if the family relies on both partners
being able to work and provide a
82
00:08:16.399 --> 00:08:24.040
lot of times when a survivor is
having trouble, performance at work suffers or
83
00:08:24.480 --> 00:08:28.519
in the ability to hold down a
job suffers. Think of, you know,
84
00:08:28.639 --> 00:08:35.279
the impact of any sort of you
know, challenges like that and how
85
00:08:35.320 --> 00:08:41.559
they lead to problems with performance or
work and that that happens. And so,
86
00:08:43.279 --> 00:08:46.360
you know, I've read stories of
people having to sell their house and
87
00:08:46.440 --> 00:08:52.200
move into an apartment or move out
of the apartment and live in their cars.
88
00:08:52.440 --> 00:08:58.879
I've seen that example to the other
thing, though, that I've seen
89
00:08:58.200 --> 00:09:03.600
is, you know, some survivors
their way of coping is to be perfect,
90
00:09:03.960 --> 00:09:09.360
right, it is perfection, and
so they work a lot and some
91
00:09:09.559 --> 00:09:16.720
of them are like executives and companies, and you know, when you're working
92
00:09:16.759 --> 00:09:22.960
a lot in you're trying to sort
of use that as a way to cover
93
00:09:22.159 --> 00:09:28.679
up all the abuse that's bubbling under
the surface. Then you know that can
94
00:09:28.720 --> 00:09:33.080
make people very successful at work and
sort of make them work a holics.
95
00:09:33.120 --> 00:09:41.799
I guess. Yeah, different ways
to cope. How would you say this
96
00:09:41.960 --> 00:09:50.200
has impacted like the extended family?
There can be some pretty dramatic effects on
97
00:09:50.279 --> 00:09:56.240
extended family, you know, particularly
if the parents were the abusers or the
98
00:09:56.320 --> 00:10:05.279
grandparents. Answer uncle people like that. When those are the abusers, then
99
00:10:05.799 --> 00:10:13.000
there can real be really big impacts
on family dynamics. You know, I've
100
00:10:13.039 --> 00:10:20.720
read cases where you know the step
dad was the abuser and then the partner
101
00:10:20.480 --> 00:10:24.559
learned from the survivor that stepped ad
the abuser and then they're like, you
102
00:10:24.639 --> 00:10:28.679
know, how do I how do
I hang out with this person who I
103
00:10:28.799 --> 00:10:31.399
used to be okay with? How
do I hang out with them now without,
104
00:10:33.159 --> 00:10:35.879
you know, wanting to beat them
into a pulp because they abused my
105
00:10:35.679 --> 00:10:41.399
partner? Basically, stuff like that. Or you see people cutting certain pieces
106
00:10:41.440 --> 00:10:46.600
of the family just out right.
I'm just cutting that part of the family
107
00:10:46.679 --> 00:10:52.919
out of our lives, no contact
and in that can be pretty traumatic,
108
00:10:54.200 --> 00:11:00.080
I guess. And you know there's
also the push and pull right. So
109
00:11:01.919 --> 00:11:05.320
you know, I want the kids
to experience their grandparents, but I don't
110
00:11:05.399 --> 00:11:09.200
want them to be around their grandparents
because of the abuse that happened, and
111
00:11:09.440 --> 00:11:16.879
so it can be kind of confusing. But you know, anything that impacts
112
00:11:18.759 --> 00:11:22.759
you know those relationships is a big
deal and you know if they're if the
113
00:11:24.399 --> 00:11:28.559
abuser was in, you know,
the families, and that makes it even
114
00:11:28.559 --> 00:11:33.600
a bigger deal and more times than
not. It generally is. It's sure
115
00:11:33.720 --> 00:11:41.759
can be. Yeah, yeah,
how how have you seen this impact like
116
00:11:41.120 --> 00:11:52.480
partners community in their social life?
Generally, it's detrimental, you know,
117
00:11:52.519 --> 00:11:58.919
when their stress in a relationship or
one partner is acting out. You know
118
00:11:58.080 --> 00:12:03.320
usually, honestly, if the survivor
acting out, it can put stress on
119
00:12:03.399 --> 00:12:11.639
social relationships. So, you know, maybe you stop getting invited to events
120
00:12:11.799 --> 00:12:18.840
from your friends because of your past
behavior that was problematic, or maybe you
121
00:12:20.000 --> 00:12:24.000
just don't want to go be around
people because you don't have the energy for
122
00:12:24.120 --> 00:12:30.080
it. It can, you know, it can have a pretty drastic impact
123
00:12:30.240 --> 00:12:39.600
on on social lives for people.
I guess another question well, like did
124
00:12:39.679 --> 00:12:45.799
you ever get tired of like are
figuring out a way to like even when
125
00:12:45.840 --> 00:12:50.159
your spouse was just talking about the
abuse too much and needing to take like
126
00:12:50.240 --> 00:12:54.519
a mental break from that because you
couldn't you know, it was it was
127
00:12:54.559 --> 00:13:01.720
a lot and it is dark.
Like how would you communicate that are what
128
00:13:03.000 --> 00:13:07.440
was your way of dealing with that
or what ways have you noticed other people
129
00:13:07.559 --> 00:13:13.279
dealing with that? Yeah, it's
in that can be challenging, right.
130
00:13:13.399 --> 00:13:18.879
So communication is is tough because,
as you touched on it, the topics
131
00:13:18.919 --> 00:13:22.679
are very sensitive and you know you
don't want to hear about them all in
132
00:13:22.799 --> 00:13:28.559
a lot of detail. So working
on communication with your partner is is a
133
00:13:28.639 --> 00:13:33.919
really important thing that can you know
some of that can come through your couple's
134
00:13:33.960 --> 00:13:41.240
counseling and you know there can be
some benefit there. The challenge, I
135
00:13:41.399 --> 00:13:46.279
think, is, you know,
honestly, the partners who come to the
136
00:13:46.360 --> 00:13:48.159
site. I think one of the
reasons they come to the side is because
137
00:13:48.200 --> 00:13:56.039
they haven't found couple's counseling to be
effective and I can echo that sentiment and
138
00:13:56.159 --> 00:14:01.320
never found it particularly effective and I'm
not sure, if not sure what's going
139
00:14:01.360 --> 00:14:05.759
on with it with that, but
I think you know, couple's counseling when
140
00:14:07.240 --> 00:14:13.360
you know one person is recovering from
childhood sexual abuse, I think it's tough
141
00:14:13.679 --> 00:14:18.759
and I'm not I don't know if
counselors are really equipped for it, but
142
00:14:18.840 --> 00:14:26.919
I know that it's it can be
somewhat effective in helping with communication. But
143
00:14:26.039 --> 00:14:31.360
again, you know, with communication
both parties have to be willing to work
144
00:14:31.480 --> 00:14:35.399
on it right. So you know
what I have the same age of,
145
00:14:37.039 --> 00:14:39.720
you know, trying to move a
string just by pushing on one end.
146
00:14:41.440 --> 00:14:43.320
You can't push a string right.
Yeah, you got to pull on a
147
00:14:43.399 --> 00:14:46.799
string and so sometimes, you know, if you're trying to work on these
148
00:14:46.840 --> 00:14:52.080
things all by yourself and your partners
not willing to do it, also it's
149
00:14:52.120 --> 00:14:54.559
like pushing on a string. You
know you're just going to you're not going
150
00:14:54.600 --> 00:14:58.480
to make any progress. You're going
to have a lot of effort but you're
151
00:14:58.480 --> 00:15:03.600
not going to make much progress.
So you know, that's my experience with
152
00:15:03.679 --> 00:15:09.639
communication. It is challenging, it
really is. There are strategies to to
153
00:15:09.759 --> 00:15:16.799
do better with communications, but if
not, it's not a Panathea for sure.
154
00:15:18.840 --> 00:15:22.919
What are some positive things about being
with survivors? Are Good things that
155
00:15:22.039 --> 00:15:28.799
people have talked about about their survivors. You know, the good things people
156
00:15:28.879 --> 00:15:35.200
talk about are, you know,
sort of the resilience that they see in
157
00:15:35.240 --> 00:15:39.639
their partners. You know, the
admiration for the resilience to keep working on
158
00:15:39.799 --> 00:15:46.200
things. It is admirable. It's
really tough. I mean I've seen it.
159
00:15:46.639 --> 00:15:50.559
I haven't experienced it right, but
I've seen recovery and what that looks
160
00:15:50.600 --> 00:15:58.480
like. It's tough and and a
lot of people admire their partners resilience and
161
00:15:58.519 --> 00:16:03.720
their tenacity for working on recovery.
A lot of them have a lot of
162
00:16:03.759 --> 00:16:10.120
compassion to for their partners because,
you know, this abuse that happened wasn't
163
00:16:10.159 --> 00:16:15.000
their fault. They may have been
taught that it was or they may think
164
00:16:15.080 --> 00:16:21.320
that it was, but it wasn't
their fault. They were manipulated and abused
165
00:16:21.519 --> 00:16:26.600
and you know, it's so there's
a lot of compassions there, I think,
166
00:16:26.679 --> 00:16:30.480
a lot of empathy and so,
you know, those are the the
167
00:16:30.600 --> 00:16:33.759
two, I think, common things
that I see and and also just you
168
00:16:33.799 --> 00:16:37.120
know, when you fall in love
with someone right, you have certain things
169
00:16:37.200 --> 00:16:42.440
you admire and those are still there. The challenges is that, you know,
170
00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:48.360
if you're not able to work through
the relationship issues them, those things
171
00:16:48.759 --> 00:16:56.279
he rode over time. Yeah,
how do you think this is impacted your
172
00:16:56.440 --> 00:17:02.919
faith and other people's faith? I
guess yeah. Well, you know,
173
00:17:03.000 --> 00:17:04.960
it's interesting when we pull faith into
this because you know, some of the
174
00:17:06.400 --> 00:17:11.599
the abuse happens through members of the
clergy, not just Catholic priests but also
175
00:17:11.720 --> 00:17:18.559
youth pastors and people like that,
and when the abuses from an institution like
176
00:17:18.640 --> 00:17:25.240
that, that's pretty bad, I
think. You know, for some people
177
00:17:25.440 --> 00:17:32.079
it it deepens their faith and for
others it drives them away and I think
178
00:17:32.119 --> 00:17:37.599
it's a very sort of individual to
the partner of the survivor on the circumstances
179
00:17:40.839 --> 00:17:45.559
about, you know, where they
are and what their personal goals are,
180
00:17:45.680 --> 00:17:49.680
what their personal journey has been.
And you know, for me personally,
181
00:17:52.440 --> 00:17:56.640
I leaned into my Catholicism for quite
a while found a lot of solace in
182
00:17:56.720 --> 00:18:03.799
that, but over time it eroted, it really did. It eroted because,
183
00:18:06.440 --> 00:18:08.720
you know, the things that I
thought were the right things to do.
184
00:18:11.359 --> 00:18:14.640
You know, I did all of
those and in you know, my
185
00:18:15.079 --> 00:18:18.119
particular faith, getting divorced means you're
not allowed to remarry write unless you get
186
00:18:18.200 --> 00:18:23.319
this thing called an annulment, and
the annulment basically says, well, never
187
00:18:23.480 --> 00:18:26.400
was a valid marriage to begin with. It's like yeah, you know,
188
00:18:26.519 --> 00:18:30.880
that just doesn't feel right. Even
though you know, getting divorced, I
189
00:18:32.000 --> 00:18:34.480
can't say that it was never a
real marriage and never should have happened.
190
00:18:37.039 --> 00:18:40.839
So that was one of the things
that's sort of chipped away at, I
191
00:18:40.920 --> 00:18:45.039
guess, my religious affiliation, but
my faith, I think, is still
192
00:18:45.839 --> 00:18:49.160
very deep, because I think they're
two different things. Oh mean, they
193
00:18:49.240 --> 00:18:56.759
most definitely are. Is there anything
else you would like to add? You
194
00:18:56.799 --> 00:18:59.359
know, I guess I would just, you know, say that if there
195
00:18:59.480 --> 00:19:07.759
are, you know, survivors listening
to this, you know, have maybe
196
00:19:07.079 --> 00:19:11.880
encourage your partner to look at the
support for partners site see if there's anything,
197
00:19:11.000 --> 00:19:15.240
anything there that they think could benefit
them, because it is tough on
198
00:19:15.440 --> 00:19:19.319
partners, you know. You know, if we're being asked to keep this
199
00:19:19.519 --> 00:19:25.799
a secret, then we can't talk
to anybody else about it. But you
200
00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:33.200
know, the forum is it's a
secure site, password protected. Every application
201
00:19:33.440 --> 00:19:37.920
is reviewed and the forums are monitored
to make sure that everything's going okay.
202
00:19:40.079 --> 00:19:45.440
But you know, your partner is
going to need some support and it's I
203
00:19:45.519 --> 00:19:48.680
think it's pretty rare that a partner
can get through all of this without some
204
00:19:48.799 --> 00:19:53.759
support from a peer support group,
either online like we have, in person,
205
00:19:53.839 --> 00:19:56.279
if you can find it, which
I think is very rare, or
206
00:19:57.039 --> 00:20:02.599
with your own individual counselor but you
know, for survivors, just keep that
207
00:20:02.680 --> 00:20:04.240
in mind. For your partners.
They're going through a tough time and you
208
00:20:04.319 --> 00:20:07.960
know, for for partners, you
know, again take a look at the
209
00:20:08.000 --> 00:20:12.759
resources out there. You know,
you can look at the site, get
210
00:20:12.839 --> 00:20:18.960
your own counselor highly recommend that,
but I would say you know, don't
211
00:20:18.359 --> 00:20:23.400
just sit there waiting for something to
happen, because that's not how it works.
212
00:20:25.480 --> 00:20:27.319
You're going to have to go get
the support and resources you need.
213
00:20:30.440 --> 00:20:34.279
Things don't just sort of get better
on their own. Yes, that's very
214
00:20:34.359 --> 00:20:41.079
true. Well, thanks for coming
on the show and thanks for well,
215
00:20:41.519 --> 00:20:45.279
your input, because, I mean
it's it's very helpful for a lot of
216
00:20:45.319 --> 00:20:48.920
people out there that, you know, they want to help their partners and
217
00:20:48.960 --> 00:20:51.559
they're like, how do I do
this? And you know, it is
218
00:20:51.640 --> 00:20:56.359
exhausting and it is it is hard, you know, it is. Yeah,
219
00:20:56.359 --> 00:21:00.599
so just you know, know that
there our resources out there to help
220
00:21:00.960 --> 00:21:07.319
and you know, I even tell
surveyor take advantage of them. Yeah,
221
00:21:07.599 --> 00:21:10.400
and I think the big thing,
I mean I've even found it hard to
222
00:21:10.480 --> 00:21:15.400
find support groups for survivors themselves,
unless they're online. Yeah, yeah,
223
00:21:15.680 --> 00:21:18.200
you can be tough. So,
I mean I can't imagine trying to find
224
00:21:18.279 --> 00:21:22.359
something, you know, it's like
trying to find Alanon without an a group.
225
00:21:26.000 --> 00:21:29.319
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and
you know, I would love for
226
00:21:30.079 --> 00:21:34.319
more in person support groups to be
available. It's just really hard to get
227
00:21:34.359 --> 00:21:40.440
those going without some you know,
helped from a local provider, I think,
228
00:21:40.839 --> 00:21:45.559
or someone who can really do that. But yeah, just reach out.
229
00:21:45.799 --> 00:21:48.240
Don't don't. Don't stay by yourself. Reach out friends and family,
230
00:21:48.559 --> 00:21:53.440
counselors, support groups, things like
that. Okay, all right, thanks
231
00:21:53.480 --> 00:21:56.759
Steve. All right, guys,
thanks for listening to Rachel and recover.
232
00:21:56.920 --> 00:22:03.480
We've got will be up next Thursday
at ten am and always follow us on
233
00:22:03.559 --> 00:22:08.400
your favorite podcast or social media platform
or come to Rachel and recoverycom thanks.
234
00:22:08.799 --> 00:22:10.440
Thanks, Rachel.
